Congo : Congo crisis is world's deadliest: survey

kemetkind

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Oct 8, 2005
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Africa is a CONTINENT - not a country. You can jump from the highest rooftop yelling africa is one nation that doesn't make it so.

When in history was the entire continent one nation? Is ASIA one nation? Is South America one nation? How many Africans consider their continent one nation?

Fact is the corruption and theft of Africa's resources is not taking place today by european military force - it requires some greedy africans to work with these foreign companies and governments.

You can blame the white man for the poverty till your blue in the face - not going to change anything. Not NOTHING. Not here in America and not in Africa. Never has. Never will. Just wasted breath.

Africans need to hold their own leaders accountable for their actions...I'm sorry - enough is enough. It's not white soldiers over there butchering people. Foreign governments and/or the CIA may have their hand in the mix stirring the pot but how can they get the primary blame?

If I sell you a gun and you use it to go shoot your mother what do you solve by coming back and blaming me?
 

militant

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Jun 21, 2005
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kemetkind said:
Africa is a CONTINENT - not a country. You can jump from the highest rooftop yelling africa is one nation that doesn't make it so.

When in history was the entire continent one nation? Is ASIA one nation? Is South America one nation? How many Africans consider their continent one nation?

Fact is the corruption and theft of Africa's resources is not taking place today by european military force - it requires some greedy africans to work with these foreign companies and governments.

You can blame the white man for the poverty till your blue in the face - not going to change anything. Not NOTHING. Not here in America and not in Africa. Never has. Never will. Just wasted breath.

Africans need to hold their own leaders accountable for their actions...I'm sorry - enough is enough. It's not white soldiers over there butchering people. Foreign governments and/or the CIA may have their hand in the mix stirring the pot but how can they get the primary blame?

If I sell you a gun and you use it to go shoot your mother what do you solve by coming back and blaming me?
I thank God, and i speak with humility, when I say i have never judged blacks in other parts of the world with such bluntness. You speak with a heart so far removed from the situation, it is no longer funny. And you dare tell me "not to blame whitey"? Have I ever asked you that question? And what will be the fall out if I dare asked it? I am beginning to wonder how different you are from the continental african immigrants whom I argue with day in day out over their criticism of blacks in america and the diaspora. I mean you and they speak with such coldness and self-righteousness its no longer funny.

If you look at the history of Africa, you will find assasinations of heads of states, amalgamations of incompatible tribes, and instigation of tribal wars including weapons supply by the same Europeans. All these were done to exploit mineral resources, and produce modern day slave plantations. This includes Tea and Cocoa grown in many areas in Africa at the expense of their own food. The result is so that someone like you can get on the internet and make such cold recommendation on a populace who are so robbed, they cannot even afford the internet to give you an alternative view point.

The Government of Nigeria at the request of oil companies whom you buy your oil for you SUVs from has deployed military in Niger-Delta to kill hungry and poor people who try to steal oil for the black markets. 11 PEOPLE WERE KILLED/MURDERED/WASTED BY THE MILITARY OVER THE PAST 3 DAYS. None of them drive cars. They were killed over what was in their land. Because some other person (white/black/yellow/latino) needed to fill up the tank in a far away land that does not necessarily value Africans. I hope you had a smooth ride home.

Enough is Enough? No, what you need to understand is we blacks are all the same in our self-righteous view of other blacks. We lack the openmind to see things from other people's view. Save for a few of us, true Pan-Africanism remains a elusive concept.
 

kemetkind

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Oct 8, 2005
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militant said:
I thank God, and i speak with humility, when I say i have never judged blacks in other parts of the world with such bluntness.
Brother militant I'm not judging anybody. Euros are using under-handed tactics sure but they need some willing AFRICAN participants.

militant said:
You speak with a heart so far removed from the situation, it is no longer funny.
Brother are you judging my heart? Of course I'm removed I don't live in Africa. But the same enemy within is right here too. Nothing about it is funny and I've never made light of it.

militant said:
And you dare tell me "not to blame whitey"? Have I ever asked you that question? And what will be the fall out if I dare asked it?
I didn't ask you not to Blame whitey I'm telling you Blaming whitey hasn't gotten black folks anywhere in the world ANYTHING.

That's why I'm so tired of hearing it.

If you sit down and think about it taking responsibility for the solution is more revolutionary than laying everything down at the foot of the white man and hoping he'll change.

militant said:
I am beginning to wonder how different you are from the continental african immigrants whom I argue with day in day out over their criticism of blacks in america and the diaspora. I mean you and they speak with such coldness and self-righteousness its no longer funny.
How am I self-righteous? I'm not judging Africans - I don't have any different opinion of how we right here in America should address our issues. It may sound cold but somebody needs to say it because all this sentimental romanticism and ego massage while NOT recognizing OUR OWN PEOPLE's role in our destruction is LITERALLY killing us.

militant said:
If you look at the history of Africa, you will find assasinations of heads of states, amalgamations of incompatible tribes, and instigation of tribal wars including weapons supply by the same Europeans. All these were done to exploit mineral resources, and produce modern day slave plantations. This includes Tea and Cocoa grown in many areas in Africa at the expense of their own food. The result is so that someone like you can get on the internet and make such cold recommendation on a populace who are so robbed, they cannot even afford the internet to give you an alternative view point.

The Government of Nigeria at the request of oil companies whom you buy your oil for you SUVs from has deployed military in Niger-Delta to kill hungry and poor people who try to steal oil for the black markets. 11 PEOPLE WERE KILLED/MURDERED/WASTED BY THE MILITARY OVER THE PAST 3 DAYS. None of them drive cars. They were killed over what was in their land. Because some other person (white/black/yellow/latino) needed to fill up the tank in a far away land that does not necessarily value Africans. I hope you had a smooth ride home.
I am not a white liberal so I'm impervious to guilt trips. I am on the internet by the grace of god who provided (my ancestors before and) me the opportunity, talent and motivation to work hard and make a way. Didn't nobody give me nothing and I've had to be twice as good as the white, indian or chinese I'm competing with just to maintain....so nah - I'm not about to feel like my lifestyle causes these black-skinned nigerian rulers to kill their own people over money. The answer is not for me to be as down-trodden as them to relieve my guilt.

I don't deny Euros have had devilish intent inside of Africa for a long, long time, as they have in most the world. But there is a reason they don't get fantastic results anymore with those tactics in china, or india...they don't have too many willing chinese ready to sell out, and if one did, you wouldn't have chinese apologists wringing their hands blaming white folks instead DEALING WITH their enemy within.

militant said:
Enough is Enough? No, what you need to understand is we blacks are all the same in our self-righteous view of other blacks. We lack the openmind to see things from other people's view. Save for a few of us, true Pan-Africanism remains a elusive concept.
Na - I see the pan-africanist point of view. It's defined differently by different people. When it's defined to include DEALING WITH your enemy, no matter WHAT his/her skin tone or hair texture might be because there is a specific goal - unification of african groups individually, then collectively, I can respect it and get motivated to work towards it.

This romantic, "All dark-skinned, kinky-haired people in the world are one country - so let's just love each other unconditionally" - i'm not feelin that.

It's fairy tale.

Internal enemies are allowed to skate on the basis of their biology alone. Real ethnic groups that really do have a shared culture WILL exist whether we get romantic about it or not.

Our families are in a jungle. We engage in battle with the leopards so we keep guard over our gate each night. We know the leopards are our enemy - their spots never change.

If one night you, one of our family, make a deal with the leopards and decide to go open the gate.... a romantic pan-africanism doesn't let me take your life same as I do the leopards. It just relegates me to whining and complaining that the leopards got in and wreaked havoc on the family. Let's me make excuses for you while lamenting that the Leopard, with the same spots, still killing my family. So, soon as I get the gate back closed another in my family, seeing the benefits you got, makes another deal to open it up and the cycle continues.
 

youngblackceo

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Jun 19, 2004
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Richmond,Va
Fact is the corruption and theft of Africa's resources is not taking place today by european military force - it requires some greedy africans to work with these foreign companies and governments.


Africans need to hold their own leaders accountable for their actions...I'm sorry - enough is enough. It's not white soldiers over there butchering people. Foreign governments and/or the CIA may have their hand in the mix stirring the pot but how can they get the primary blame?

If I sell you a gun and you use it to go shoot your mother what do you solve by coming back and blaming me?[/quote]
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I'm going to respond to this because I believe this may have been in response to my post. The first thing I want to say is, I'm getting so sick of people making and argument about how Africans should take responsibility for what's going on in Africa and how we sold each other into slavery. It never fails everytime we start to talk about our situation as African people in the world some group of negroes will come out of their mouth with "Let's not blame the white man speech". Look when we speak about what has happened in history and what is continually going on in the lives of Africans in this world is not in anyway an attempt to lay blame on anyone else our diffuse responsibility from ourselves. In order for us to solve the problems that exist we have to not only deal with it internally, we must also deal with it from and external perspective. So if you think we are going to even begin to solve our problems just by looking at our problems one sided you are not being very realistic. Because African people have and has had a very real enemy who has manipulated and exploited African people. They have studied us and our ways and they have developed strategies to take advantage of our weaknesses and our strengths. So yes we have corrupt leaders who are greedy and take advantage of their people. But who put these people in charge, what university were these leaders educated in? Who supports these leaders and supply them with the weapons that they use to terrorize their people? Most importantly who has benefitted from the fact that we have these types of leaders not only in Africa but also here in this country? Who is cashing in from the fact that Africans have such weak leadership? What is going on here you have puppet leaders who are brought and paid for by western nations. This is another old trick done by the imperalist to give the illusion of power. While the european nations own and control all of the resources they give some bourgeious class of Africans some political clout with a fancy title. They continue to rob the land of all of it's resources and when things go bad they are in the clear, because look who is running the country it's not us. You see you have and African man in charge. This game serves two purposes it not only clears the real puppeteer from his part in all of the destruction. The uninformed european also gets a boast to his or her ego because they can say you see I told you we were right. They can't run their own country. Look at them it's not us who are doing the killing they are killing themselves. We told you it was just in their nature. Know Africans all over the world especially in america this situation will only make us dig a deeper hole in the shame and guilt we have about Africa. It will only play into our feeling of inferiority that much more. That's way we cannot just deal with it as if it's just and issue of Africans being evil are corrupt because it will only lead us to being self defeative and resentful towards one another and that's what's going on right know. I'm not saying we should not forget our role in this as a people, because we definitely play a supporting role in our own destruction. But in order for us to break the cycle we have to look at the root cause of these problems from every angle and when you do that it seems the one constant that keeps coming up is our relationship with whites. That's just a fact it is not about blaming anyone but everywhere you go on this earth the same scenario is playing itself out. So how are we going to deal with our problems. We have got to talk about how we have related to whites because you have never seen a small group of Africans go anywhere of this earth and completely destroy a people and their culture. No where in history have a small group of Africans gone into another country and butchered and slaughtered a people to conquer and plunder their resources. But yet this happened to us time and time again by a small group of europeans.

Africa is a CONTINENT - not a country. You can jump from the highest rooftop yelling africa is one nation that doesn't make it so.

When in history was the entire continent one nation? Is ASIA one nation? Is South America one nation? How many Africans consider their continent one nation?


You see this statement right here is a prime example of how we as Africans have been severely miseducated. Like I said before a peoples education should be based on solving their problems. So what if Asians don't see themselves as one nation, so what if europeans don't see themselves as one nation. That why of thinking may work for them because based on their intentionality are what they want to accomplish as a people that may work for them. You see they can look at their history and decide that this why of thinking and relating themselves to one another may have been successful for them. But the African must look at his history as a people and see if that why of thinking works for his people and if it has not work then we must look at another way of thinking to accomplish our goals and what we want as a people. That's way you cannot look at another peoples way of thinking and stupidly believe what they think represents universality. You have got to decide what works for you based on your history and your intentionality.
So who says Africa is not one nation where is that written in stone. What if Africans look at their history and see the mistakes we have made and come to a conclusion that part of the problem is that we have not as a people come together under a collective flag. The result of us not doing this has resulted in what we see today. Know if we come to this conclusion it only makes sense that we change how we see ourselves right. We can't and should not base this decision on what the asians are doing. Just something to think about you know. We have to remember that man's mind is mobile you don't have to stay stuck in one mode with one idea on how to do things.


You can blame the white man for the poverty till your blue in the face - not going to change anything. Not NOTHING. Not here in America and not in Africa. Never has. Never will. Just wasted breath.

You see this is the voice of an African who has been completely defeated. He does not think anything will change because he believes deep down inside that we as Africans don't have want it takes to change the situation. He believes that the european will always rule over us because we lack the technical savvy to compete with him. He sounds just like the Israelites who got spooked when Moses sent them into Jerusalem. He truly does not believe that we when can win. So to keep his damage ego intact he will continue to lash out at the African because he is afraid to deal with our real enemy. So to compensate his fear which he has to deny to keep what little sanity he has. He must completely remove the white man from the role he has played in this destruction because in reality he does not want to confront this man. You see this is what's going on in Africa and right here in america with the black man he is afraid to confront white men so what does he do he vents his frustration out on those close to him and those who are most vunerable to his attack. That's what this black on black violence is all about we have been punked by white men he has completely emasculated us as a group of men. So the only way we can feel like we are real men is by proving how tough we are and how bad we are as men that's what's going with this thug ****. We are compensating are fear of confronting our real enemy by destroying each other and our nation. I'm sorry if I offended you brother it is not personel. I was just making a point about how we have been made to think and see ourselves in this world.
 

kemetkind

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Oct 8, 2005
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Brother most of your post was either a reiteration of my view or a misunderstanding of it.


youngblackceo said:


I'm going to respond to this because I believe this may have been in response to my post. The first thing I want to say is, I'm getting so sick of people making and argument about how Africans should take responsibility for what's going on in Africa and how we sold each other into slavery. It never fails everytime we start to talk about our situation as African people in the world some group of negroes will come out of their mouth with "Let's not blame the white man speech".....
I'm not going to battle with you. I'm not here for that. I've seen that approach over and over on this board - someone doesn't agree with a brother so he comes out calling names like mis-educated, or negroes, or claiming they have slave mentality, or even "stupid". Let's break down the merits of the arguments instead of trying to break down each other.

youngblackceo said:

Look when we speak about what has happened in history and what is continually going on in the lives of Africans in this world is not in anyway an attempt to lay blame on anyone else our diffuse responsibility from ourselves. In order for us to solve the problems that exist we have to not only deal with it internally, we must also deal with it from and external perspective.
This is why I made the metaphor with the leopards - his spots don't change. We know they're the enemy and we know they're job is to divide and destroy us. That's why it's wasted energy to sit around on topic after topic, issue after issue, all your focus is on talking about how bad that leopard is.

THAT is the DEFEATED mindset!

THAT is the UNREALISTIC mindset. Can you not see that?

How does pointing out over and over what we already know SOLVE anything? We been whining about the leopard since the 60s instead of training up more folks who WILL hunt leopards and WHO WILL hunt you too if you are helping leopards destroy us.

kemetkind said:
Africa is a CONTINENT - not a country. You can jump from the highest rooftop yelling africa is one nation that doesn't make it so.

When in history was the entire continent one nation? Is ASIA one nation? Is South America one nation? How many Africans consider their continent one nation?


youngblackceo said:


You see this statement right here is a prime example of how we as Africans have been severely miseducated. Like I said before a peoples education should be based on solving their problems. So what if Asians don't see themselves as one nation, so what if europeans don't see themselves as one nation. That why of thinking may work for them because based on their intentionality are what they want to accomplish as a people that may work for them. You see they can look at their history and decide that this why of thinking and relating themselves to one another may have been successful for them. But the African must look at his history as a people and see if that why of thinking works for his people and if it has not work then we must look at another way of thinking to accomplish our goals and what we want as a people. That's way you cannot look at another peoples way of thinking and stupidly believe what they think represents universality. You have got to decide what works for you based on your history and your intentionality.
So who says Africa is not one nation where is that written in stone. What if Africans look at their history and see the mistakes we have made and come to a conclusion that part of the problem is that we have not as a people come together under a collective flag. The result of us not doing this has resulted in what we see today. Know if we come to this conclusion it only makes sense that we change how we see ourselves right. We can't and should not base this decision on what the asians are doing. Just something to think about you know. We have to remember that man's mind is mobile you don't have to stay stuck in one mode with one idea on how to do things.
Guess what I agree with your premises almost 100% but I disagree with your conclusions.

You say the African shouldn't base his actions solely based on what other groups have done - I agree with that. But just like you say the whites have studied us WE have to study what others have done that is working against euro aggression. Did Japan decide they needed to go unite with china and korea in order to deal with their enemy? Who does the white man FEAR the most today as a threat - All asian looking people or the Chinese Nation? It's about realistically evaluating the landscape and evaluating what works - not copying.

Panafricanist who think all africans can be jumbled under one flag are DOING THE SAME THING EUROS did - that is trying to force a group of africans together for their own purposes. Even though their purposes are positive It's not going to happen man...and moreover it doesn't NEED to happen.

There needs to be unity ACROSS these groups but that won't occur until there is unity WITHIN them first.

It's FLAT OUT PIPE DREAM to expect all 1.8 billion of us to wake up one day and say hey - we all have kinky hair, we all battling the euros - let's be one country.

Look I'm ALL FOR IT if it were realistic. It's a great start to a solution if it were realistic. But you have to deal with the world the way it is not the way we want it to be.

You say we shouldn't be stuck in one mind set...I agree with that 100%. But my conclusion is the pro-black/pan-africanist set has DONE exactly that...still using the ideology from 50 years ago when obviously it has proven ineffective.

The change I'm suggesting is that we quit trying to claim everybody based on biology. Base it on something else so you can safely DESTROY someone who has your same biology because if they are PROVEN TO BE coordinating with the enemy to DESTROY you.

Quit trying to force folks together who don't want to be together. Let them exist as cohesive groups first, build their own unity, then let them interface with other african nations. If Africa was divided improperly by europeans Africans should redo the map with their own nation building efforts.

Quit making excuses for those among us that are so lost that they're killing our own children and destroying our own women.

Quit building the white man up into some mythical all conquering figure and be willing to deal with him the same way you'll deal with your brother who you disagree with.

Quit whining and start proposing solutions and initiating action.

youngblackceo said:

That's what this black on black violence is all about we have been punked by white men he has completely emasculated us as a group of men. So the only way we can feel like we are real men is by proving how tough we are and how bad we are as men that's what's going with this thug ****. We are compensating are fear of confronting our real enemy by destroying each other and our nation. I'm sorry if I offended you brother it is not personel. I was just making a point about how we have been made to think and see ourselves in this world.
I agree with that brother young. Some of us have been punked by white men...some of us speak frankly to white men daily. Some of us would be willing to sacrifice this American dream - and work with other like-minded brothers towards real nation-building...and all that it entails.

But some of us will come out guns blaring against a brother but turn into mouses against their true enemy. Some of us got nothing to say when it's time to actually DO something other than talk. Sad thing is I see a lot of those include the so called pro-black among us who have whipped themselves into a stand-still trance making the all-powerful white man the cause AND SOLUTION of every problem. They might not have thug images but they have just as much a thug / gang mentality cause they come out rhetorical guns blazing against any brother who would disagree with them...no matter how slight the differences really are.

Don't worry brother - you didnt offend me and I know it's not personal. But africans on the continent and right here need new strats cause the old ones aren't getting it done.
 

militant

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Jun 21, 2005
335
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Thanks youngblackceo. There is no economic benefit in trying to make my points here. I continue to make my points by the actions I take to help my people in Africa recover. But for the sake of enlightenment I will engage in this reply to my message.

kemetkind said:
Brother militant I'm not judging anybody. Euros are using under-handed tactics sure but they need some willing AFRICAN participants.
Borther, those talking points sounds awfully familiar. Again, like the case of slavery in which it is popularly used, the "willing African participants" are such a small minority, that an indictment on the entire African continent is criminal at best.

Brother are you judging my heart? Of course I'm removed I don't live in Africa. But the same enemy within is right here too. Nothing about it is funny and I've never made light of it.
Read your posts about African issues, and then read your same posts about Diaporan black issues. The only person on this forum I know who seems to have the same hardline "black must take responsiblity" view regardless of ethnicity, is a certain lady whose name escapes me. And I appreciate her lack of bias.

I didn't ask you not to Blame whitey I'm telling you Blaming whitey hasn't gotten black folks anywhere in the world ANYTHING.That's why I'm so tired of hearing it.
I know of no post of yours which use those words.

If you sit down and think about it taking responsibility for the solution is more revolutionary than laying everything down at the foot of the white man and hoping he'll change.
Oh My God, you sound so much like those african immigrants, you really have to meet up with them. You all want blacks to take responsiblity for their problems. They made the same disgusting arguments with regards to the victims in Katrina. I believe you will get along with them.....NOT!!! Both you and they use such noble words of self-responsiblity when it does not apply to their own ethnicity.

How am I self-righteous? I'm not judging Africans - I don't have any different opinion of how we right here in America should address our issues. It may sound cold but somebody needs to say it because all this sentimental romanticism and ego massage while NOT recognizing OUR OWN PEOPLE's role in our destruction is LITERALLY killing us.
None of your posts where you have such views on blacks anywhere outside Africa are memorable. Like I said, show me one! What you need to do is take a book about African history post-colonialism and READ IT!! Do you think the Icons of African liberation became free so that their people ould suffer? PATRICE LUMUMBA USED THE WORDS "ALL AFRICANS SHOULD CONTROL AFRICAN RESOURCES" in the 1950s!! But that cant happen if a certain Kemestry was to access the internet in 2006 thanks to stolen african resources, only to blame Africans for not wanting to take responsiblities. He was assasinated by outsiders and rogue government was instilled in the nation of Congo!

I am not a white liberal so I'm impervious to guilt trips.
I appreciate your honesty. Rather that than fake compassion.

I am on the internet by the grace of god who provided (my ancestors before and) me the opportunity, talent and motivation to work hard and make a way.
And may that same God repay those whose resources were exploited!!
Didn't nobody give me nothing and I've had to be twice as good as the white, indian or chinese I'm competing with just to maintain....so nah
Again, your inability to think outside your own nation. Now you acknowledge racism only in the American context. You had the opportunity to be twice as good. Thats what these same African immigrants I argue with say. They say that in a land of opportunities, how can people still be poor and live in the ghettos. Are you saying those africans in Africa have the exact same opportunities as you?

- I'm not about to feel like my lifestyle causes these black-skinned nigerian rulers to kill their own people over money. The answer is not for me to be as down-trodden as them to relieve my guilt.
Hehe...How far can you go with this?

I don't deny Euros have had devilish intent inside of Africa for a long, long time, as they have in most the world.
Then would you please factor it in. Do you honeslty believe in your heart of hearts, that if an African nation was to rise the way China is doinf, that no efforts will be made to twart its rise?
But there is a reason they don't get fantastic results anymore with those tactics in china, or india...
You are unbelievable!! For the same da/mn reason there is preferential treatment in America, the same to which you admitted in "I've had to be twice as good as the white, indian or chinese I'm competing with just to maintain". There is investment, and outsourcing going to India and China. Infact, these Indians and chinese were actively trained so that they could partake in the outsourcing. Ghana, Nigeria and South Africa all have viable IT workers who could participate in this outsourcing. But NO! There are no jobs from your country going to them. Niether is investment, because once there is famine in Kenya, the whole Africa is painted as a bad investment spot. GOOD.....GOD....IS THERE AN END TO THIS?

they don't have too many willing chinese ready to sell out, and if one did, you wouldn't have chinese apologists wringing their hands blaming white folks instead DEALING WITH their enemy within.
Hehe.... By the way are you a Reverend Jesse Peterson or Bill Cosby fan by any chance? You couldnt be if you are on Destee.com!

Na - I see the pan-africanist point of view. It's defined differently by different people. When it's defined to include DEALING WITH your enemy, no matter WHAT his/her skin tone or hair texture might be because there is a specific goal - unification of african groups individually, then collectively, I can respect it and get motivated to work towards it.
I thought as much. I never expected better from you.

This romantic, "All dark-skinned, kinky-haired people in the world are one country - so let's just love each other unconditionally" - i'm not feelin that.

It's fairy tale.
Yeah, I thought as much, I never expected better of you.

Internal enemies are allowed to skate on the basis of their biology alone. Real ethnic groups that really do have a shared culture WILL exist whether we get romantic about it or not.
Hehe....If I got a dime for the number of times I have heard this. Look, I never force anyone to be one with me. I know there will always be recalcitrant types, who give excuse for their coldness towards Africans including such talking points like "You sould us into slavery".

Our families are in a jungle. We engage in battle with the leopards so we keep guard over our gate each night. We know the leopards are our enemy - their spots never change.

If one night you, one of our family, make a deal with the leopards and decide to go open the gate.... a romantic pan-africanism doesn't let me take your life same as I do the leopards. It just relegates me to whining and complaining that the leopards got in and wreaked havoc on the family. Let's me make excuses for you while lamenting that the Leopard, with the same spots, still killing my family. So, soon as I get the gate back closed another in my family, seeing the benefits you got, makes another deal to open it up and the cycle continues.
Hehe...whatever. I wont even bother to decipher.
 

kemetkind

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MEMBER
Oct 8, 2005
1,599
63
Still haven't learned to disagree w/o being disagreeable.

Doctor Militant:

I am disagreeing with your argument - I am not attacking you but your argument. You are disagreeing with my argument; you are attacking me rather than addressing my argument. I don't know how to state it any more simply than that.

Also if you're saying I've posted in other threads anything OTHER than Blacks in America have ultimate responsibility for improving our condition, it only means
A) you haven't read my posts, or
B) you didn't comprehend my point,
C) or you're flat out being untruthful.

Any one who has dealt with me on these forums or in Chat will tell you I've said the same things about black americans and spend a whole lot less time talking about continental africans than about us over here.

No way my rhetoric is similar to Bill Cosby because I don't leave out the fact that the euro power structure IS the ultimate enemy and has to be dealt with.

But you know...We can't have a discussion if only one party desires to comprehend and desires to maintain mutual respect - so I'll leave this one with you alone.
 

militant

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Jun 21, 2005
335
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kemetkind said:
Doctor Militant:

I am disagreeing with your argument - I am not attacking you but your argument. You are disagreeing with my argument; you are attacking me rather than addressing my argument. I don't know how to state it any more simply than that.

Also if you're saying I've posted in other threads anything OTHER than Blacks in America have ultimate responsibility for improving our condition, it only means
A) you haven't read my posts, or
B) you didn't comprehend my point,
C) or you're flat out being untruthful.

Any one who has dealt with me on these forums or in Chat will tell you I've said the same things about black americans and spend a whole lot less time talking about continental africans than about us over here.

No way my rhetoric is similar to Bill Cosby because I don't leave out the fact that the euro power structure IS the ultimate enemy and has to be dealt with.

But you know...We can't have a discussion if only one party desires to comprehend and desires to maintain mutual respect - so I'll leave this one with you alone.
Again, I have said one thing that plagues the black community is our inability to think outside the box. We cry and wail about our problems, but never understand the complex dynamics of other black people's problems. I have never claimed to understand racism in America in its full entirety. And I will never simplify it with the statements like you just used. The complexity of the African problems baffles think tanks that I am involved in. We are confronted with problems like (1) how do you create a strategy for growth of Africa with all the globalization and unfair trade practices. (2) How do you utilize mineral resources when they are carted away to foreign lands. These are real problems which we brainstrom everyday. For you to indict a continent for not taking responsiblities is a disservice to those involved in a think tank like me.

As to who does alot of talking about whom, I will just say thats a lie. All black "ethnicites" talk about the other ethnicites. I will be a disingenouous pro-black person if i did not admit that truth. There is a reason that all blacks i know seem to have the same talking points about other ethnicities of black. Its due to propagation of memes by discussions. Do not deny that simple sociocultural truth. No one is innocent!
 

youngblackceo

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Jun 19, 2004
230
5
Richmond,Va
kemetkind said:
Brother militant I'm not judging anybody. Euros are using under-handed tactics sure but they need some willing AFRICAN participants.


Brother are you judging my heart? Of course I'm removed I don't live in Africa. But the same enemy within is right here too. Nothing about it is funny and I've never made light of it.



I didn't ask you not to Blame whitey I'm telling you Blaming whitey hasn't gotten black folks anywhere in the world ANYTHING.

That's why I'm so tired of hearing it.

If you sit down and think about it taking responsibility for the solution is more revolutionary than laying everything down at the foot of the white man and hoping he'll change.



How am I self-righteous? I'm not judging Africans - I don't have any different opinion of how we right here in America should address our issues. It may sound cold but somebody needs to say it because all this sentimental romanticism and ego massage while NOT recognizing OUR OWN PEOPLE's role in our destruction is LITERALLY killing us.


I am not a white liberal so I'm impervious to guilt trips. I am on the internet by the grace of god who provided (my ancestors before and) me the opportunity, talent and motivation to work hard and make a way. Didn't nobody give me nothing and I've had to be twice as good as the white, indian or chinese I'm competing with just to maintain....so nah - I'm not about to feel like my lifestyle causes these black-skinned nigerian rulers to kill their own people over money. The answer is not for me to be as down-trodden as them to relieve my guilt.

I don't deny Euros have had devilish intent inside of Africa for a long, long time, as they have in most the world. But there is a reason they don't get fantastic results anymore with those tactics in china, or india...they don't have too many willing chinese ready to sell out, and if one did, you wouldn't have chinese apologists wringing their hands blaming white folks instead DEALING WITH their enemy within.



Na - I see the pan-africanist point of view. It's defined differently by different people. When it's defined to include DEALING WITH your enemy, no matter WHAT his/her skin tone or hair texture might be because there is a specific goal - unification of african groups individually, then collectively, I can respect it and get motivated to work towards it.

This romantic, "All dark-skinned, kinky-haired people in the world are one country - so let's just love each other unconditionally" - i'm not feelin that.

It's fairy tale.

Internal enemies are allowed to skate on the basis of their biology alone. Real ethnic groups that really do have a shared culture WILL exist whether we get romantic about it or not.

Our families are in a jungle. We engage in battle with the leopards so we keep guard over our gate each night. We know the leopards are our enemy - their spots never change.

If one night you, one of our family, make a deal with the leopards and decide to go open the gate.... a romantic pan-africanism doesn't let me take your life same as I do the leopards. It just relegates me to whining and complaining that the leopards got in and wreaked havoc on the family. Let's me make excuses for you while lamenting that the Leopard, with the same spots, still killing my family. So, soon as I get the gate back closed another in my family, seeing the benefits you got, makes another deal to open it up and the cycle continues.

I didn't ask you not to Blame whitey I'm telling you Blaming whitey hasn't gotten black folks anywhere in the world ANYTHING.

That's why I'm so tired of hearing it.


You are right just blaming the european is not going to get us anywhere. But I don't see where brother militant are myself is clearly just sitting back and blaming white folks. Where are you getting that from is it because of the fact that we are pointing out and obvious historical reality. You made this reference.

Our families are in a jungle. We engage in battle with the leopards so we keep guard over our gate each night. We know the leopards are our enemy - their spots never change.

If one night you, one of our family, make a deal with the leopards and decide to go open the gate.... a romantic pan-africanism doesn't let me take your life same as I do the leopards. It just relegates me to whining and complaining that the leopards got in and wreaked havoc on the family. Let's me make excuses for you while lamenting that the Leopard, with the same spots, still killing my family. So, soon as I get the gate back closed another in my family, seeing the benefits you got, makes another deal to open it up and the cycle continues.[/QUOTE]


First of all the African has not even come into realization of who and what our enemy is. So before we can even talk about all of the internal strifes we have to get over. The first thing we have to recognize is just like our ancestors in the past we have not properly defined what type of relationship we should have with these people. We have never looked at white people as our collective enemy so there for you cannot apply that analogy to our situation. So we must examine their history and how it relates to us. Because when you deal with your family situation and hand out punishment to those who have betrayed the family and let the leopard in. Afther you've gotten all of that straight, guess what you still have to deal with the leopard. The leopard is not going anywhere he is still going to find ways to breach your defense. So in order to properly defend yourself and your family you can't just sitback and blame the weak amongst your own for selling out. You have to also deal with the criminal in the middle who is manipulating the situation for his own benefit. Doing that does not mean you are taking away responsibility from self. But in order to develop the proper strategy to effectively deal with your external enemy. You have to find out what's motivating these people? What are their true intentions? These are just some questions but you can get a good picture of what I'm getting at. Anotherthing is when you develop a strategy based on this information you can then relay this information back to your people. You can use this information know to create a sense of unity and direction. You can teach your people in real time. The errors in their ways and show them how a few traders and fools amongst us who sacriface the lives of many to feed their own selfish desires. Can disrupt and create havoc in our nation, with that way of teaching you can create a system of reward and punishment to farther engrain a particular way of thinking in your people. This will create a code of ethics amongst our people that we can use to guage if our behavior. You see know we have away of distinguishing who is friend or foe based on our historical and political, and social reality.
 

kemetkind

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Oct 8, 2005
1,599
63
Good discussion

youngblackceo said:

You are right just blaming the european is not going to get us anywhere. But I don't see where brother militant are myself is clearly just sitting back and blaming white folks. Where are you getting that from is it because of the fact that we are pointing out and obvious historical reality. You made this reference.
You're right. I made the reference out of frustration because on this thread and on so many others - that's where it starts - pointing out the white root of the problem - and that's where it ends. I didn't see you or militant proposing potential solutions so it appeared to fall right in line with what I see as a victim mentality about solutions.

youngblackceo said:


First of all the African has not even come into realization of who and what our enemy is. So before we can even talk about all of the internal strifes we have to get over. The first thing we have to recognize is just like our ancestors in the past we have not properly defined what type of relationship we should have with these people. We have never looked at white people as our collective enemy so there for you cannot apply that analogy to our situation. So we must examine their history and how it relates to us. Because when you deal with your family situation and hand out punishment to those who have betrayed the family and let the leopard in. Afther you've gotten all of that straight, guess what you still have to deal with the leopard. The leopard is not going anywhere he is still going to find ways to breach your defense. So in order to properly defend yourself and your family you can't just sitback and blame the weak amongst your own for selling out. You have to also deal with the criminal in the middle who is manipulating the situation for his own benefit. Doing that does not mean you are taking away responsibility from self. But in order to develop the proper strategy to effectively deal with your external enemy. You have to find out what's motivating these people? What are their true intentions? These are just some questions but you can get a good picture of what I'm getting at. Anotherthing is when you develop a strategy based on this information you can then relay this information back to your people. You can use this information know to create a sense of unity and direction. You can teach your people in real time. The errors in their ways and show them how a few traders and fools amongst us who sacriface the lives of many to feed their own selfish desires. Can disrupt and create havoc in our nation, with that way of teaching you can create a system of reward and punishment to farther engrain a particular way of thinking in your people. This will create a code of ethics amongst our people that we can use to guage if our behavior. You see know we have away of distinguishing who is friend or foe based on our historical and political, and social reality.

BROTHER that is excellent. It is a refutation of my argument on the grounds of the argument itself.

I agree with most of it especially the novel method you propose for dealing with internal enemies and further communicating their weaknesses back to the people. We're on the same page here. It seems you're agreeing that internal enemy has to be dealt with...there's no argument from me that the leopard does too.

I also agree with you 100% that we have to DEFINE what our interface is with the leopard. We can't just believe we're going to go wipe them all out in one fell swoop if we'd all just unite, or that we should turn away from any dealings with them completely. That interface needs to change as our relative strength changes. China is dancing with the leopard AND beating it at its own game...it's holding the notes on America's economic prosperity and slowly gathering more and more of the cards into its own hand. But it didn't start the dance from a position of weakness.

African nations have to dance in the global markets too, but they must dance from a position of strength. This is where pan-africanism comes to mind for me - the strength is in unified economic and military blocs, not trying to cobble us all together as one country. Euros use subterfuge to keep this from happening by propping up their puppets, but again, whose responsibility is it finance the removal of these puppets?

I don't agree however that the African, continental or diasporan, doesn't know who is our enemy. Why is it that you can go to any board like this and you'll see similar threads pointing out white people's role in our problems? Any barbershop? Any church? Maybe the most uninformed in the masses don't understand but the thought leaders do and those that are cutting these deals with euros definitely do.

I think we don't know who are enemy within is - who is allowing the enemy externally to have so great an impact on our progress. When we do know him - we aren't willing to exact justice for him. We're spending TOO much effort on analyzing the HISTORY of the problem, which we've done a good job of - but not enough on proposing and executing realistic solutions.

Brother I invite you join the brothers of Destee on Monday night
for brothers only chat where we will begin to propose solutions to specific problems we can impact and action plans to implement them.
 

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