Black Relationships : Brothers Are You Ready For your woman?

spicybrown

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Oct 21, 2005
4,201
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Samurai and Uplift sittin' in a tree.................. d-e-b-a-t-i-n-g.:x:

*Phew*, I can picture the two of you dabating face to face, all the mean muggin'.... explosive energy just perculatin.....LOL. I need to vote Uplift onto the ~Destee Debate Team~
 

SAMURAI36

Banned
MEMBER
Mar 3, 2005
4,762
237
Bay Area
uplift19 said:
Because I read the entire post. Just because you did not get the desired response, does not mean it was not recognized.

Again, How do I know that you have read it? Especially if you do not post the statement as a quote (that is the reason for doing that, afterall), or if your response is not catered to my original statement?

How did I make a point against it? I was agreeing with you, but just stated that there are reasons present in society that may prevent everyone from seeing the immaturily you can so readily identify. I think this goes beyond how one is dressed.

Visual indicators such as how one is dressed, is not considered "readily identifiable"?

This is why I said it seems that you seem to justify things on the woman's side, while the male's perspective is that he has to fend for himself.

Because you explicity stated this was your course of action, so I was assuming you saw this move as helping towards the solution to your problem and not a further hinderance to it. Yes, I live in a metropolitian area. Yes, the women I know are from these areas. How does this information help you in any way, especially considering I have already stated how few female friends I have (a bit of "background info" on me :fyi:)?

Just because I stated that this was my course of action, doesn't mean it necessarily constitutes a solution. You asked me what I planned to do, and I told you. I'm hoping that it's a solution, but then I'm not really sure, that's why I'm sharing this here.

Why is everything so clandestine, as far as where you live? :confused:

I have already posted this information.
Where? Would it hurt to post it again?

I am not sure if the one group is still having meetings, etc. but some of the others focus on marriage. You may/may not find those resources valuable given your views on the institution of marriage.

Oh, I thought you'd said that they help Black people with relationship issues, you didn't say specifically they were marriage counselors.


It is all irrelevant to this particular discussion, because it is about education and not relationships. I am not presently in the 6th grade, so it was obviously in the past. Either way, I was not in the "average" classes so my personal education does not represent the masses. Where I live, the educational system is in turmoil, so I know for a fact they are less prepared than I was.

So in other words, my analogy is "irrelevant", simply because it is not going to be entertained.

Even more significant to me, is a comment made by an elder at a meeting I recently attended. She received her first degree in the early 1900's, and currently has her master's degree in education. Her assessment is that our community was better educated during segregation.

And this is somehow relevant to the discussion? :confused:

Acknowleding that I have my own perspective that is different from your own does not negate either.

Isn't this a given? Well, perhaps not; I can't seem to tell when you're agreeing with me, and you seem to overstate the obvious when you don't.

I think those reaons are the same. Women in US society did not have the same opportunities back in the day as there are now. Economic security and the values of the society made divorce unpopular. All of that has changed now, especially in our community, as single-parent households are increasingly the norm. This makes the ideal family model of two married parents less important to many women who are having children now.

I agree.

What would make you take me seriously at this point, save my entire life story? I am at a loss.

Answering specific questions when asked would help. :fyi:I really can't see how it's that difficult.

I am not sure why you have such an issue with this, as I have already stated my reasons for doing so. If you think preventing a 2-page post by not reposting your entire response (which everyone can go back and see in its entirety btw) is "omiting its validity" then you are mistaken.

Your response is already over a half-page long. Otherwise, why quote anyone's statments at all? You could do like alot of people here do, and just quote my entire post, and then respond to only to the points that you deem most relevant.

Good communication, as I just mentioned.

I agree, but that's one more quality that's missing from AA relationships, based on my involvements in them.



See the statement that immediately proceeded the one you quoted. Once again, you omit the very statements that are crucial to my responses, even as you ask a question in response to it.

What specifically will help you do this?

Answering direct questions that are posed to you.

You are free to do what you wish, as you know.

Why what was an issue exactly?

If you think I am being critical so be it.

No it would not. Your question "how much" was very general, and may have been able to be answered with any degree of accuracy if it was more specific.

I haven't been quantifying anything.

This is just going in circles, and only serving to take us further and further off-topic.

This has been my experience in this very community. The source of my perspectives is my own life and experiences others have shared with me. I have stated this repeatedly.

OK.

Because at the time I did not realize I wasn't being taken seriously...

And now that you do realize this....?

Because I am talking about actual experiences that actually happened, not hypothetical situations.

If you can't quantify these experiences in real-time, then what choice does the person that you are sharing these experiences with have, than to not take them seriously?

I don't see why this is so difficult; I broke down my perspective of my upbringing, as to not only leave no doubt in your mind about it, but also to paint a larger picture about why I think and perceive relationships and involvements and interactions with Black women the way I do.

Are you telling me that this was not helpful for you?


OK.

In the last 60 days, in chat, via email, and in this very thread.

Is it really that much of an inconvenience for you to repeat any of this?

I never said it was. For me, to empathize with someone means I can identify with what they are going through. For instance, I would never tell a woman who comes to me saying she has been raped or that they lost their mother at a young age (as a friend of mine did, to validate) that I empathize because I cannot begin to know what that feels like. Saying I do without having gone through it or something similar cheapens what they have experienced. I wouldn't dare say "I know how you feel" because I do not
.

Yes, but that's not precisely what empathy means. To empathize means to identify with the feeling, not the source of the feeling. Have you never been violated in anyway? If you have ever felt any form of violation, powerlessness, helplessness, etc, then you can indeed imagine what it's like to have been raped.

Didn't you say that alot of your perspectives are based on what others have shared with you?

So what behavior does your being male excuse?

None.

I don't know what you think females are supposed to be, quite honestly.

Females are supposed to be human beings; living, breathing mammals who breathe air and drink liquids, who are supposed to be responsible for their own destinies......Just like males are.

What are the "kinds" of interest?

Synonymous with level of interest: casual, indifferent, ulterior motive, true concern, etc.

So be it.

Everyone's intentions are not the same.

"Well feel free to use that as a rule of thumb for me."

But it confuses the issue.

For who?

So then why are you know adding emotions to that discussion and carrying them into this one?

#1) Who said I was doing any such thing? Where did you get that I was doing that in my response to which you quoted?

#2) What does that have to do with the question I posed to you?

...

Already addressed..

Call me what you will, whether it is an "un-truth" or not.

OK.

Not quite, you just have the longest posts. I also participate in chat, and further I have given information when asked for just FYI, not in the course of a "debate" where it is almost certain it will be miscontrued.

I don't see you interacting with that many people on the boards (not including chat, where I don't go), and certainly not for as long and as often as you do with me.

The length of my posts has nothing to do with how often you respond to them.


Stating you do not have information is not the same as asking a question. I find it hard to believe that knowing what you do know so far, and being that you were unable to even give a public "thank you" in another discussion because of whatever it is you wanted to share personally, that you are so misunderstanding of this.

Huh? :confused:

I fail to see how the merging of these 3 statements results in a single point.

Good question. I do not know, but this is definately not what I had in mind. :bye:

Fair enough.
 

uplift19

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Mar 6, 2006
669
12
spicybrown said:
Samurai and Uplift sittin' in a tree.................. d-e-b-a-t-i-n-g.:x:

*Phew*, I can picture the two of you dabating face to face, all the mean muggin'.... explosive energy just perculatin.....LOL. I need to vote Uplift onto the ~Destee Debate Team~
:lol: Sis Spicy ur funny...hey...no mean muggin here...:angel1:
 

uplift19

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Mar 6, 2006
669
12
SAMURAI36 said:
Again, How do I know that you have read it? Especially if you do not post the statement as a quote (that is the reason for doing that, afterall), or if your response is not catered to my original statement?
Because I just stated I did.

Visual indicators such as how one is dressed, is not considered "readily identifiable"?
Yes.

This is why I said it seems that you seem to justify things on the woman's side, while the male's perspective is that he has to fend for himself.
Not sure why you got that impression, as I agreed with this point.

Just because I stated that this was my course of action, doesn't mean it necessarily constitutes a solution. You asked me what I planned to do, and I told you. I'm hoping that it's a solution, but then I'm not really sure, that's why I'm sharing this here.
Well we won't really know, until that happens.

Why is everything so clandestine, as far as where you live? :confused:
I answered your direct questions.

I have already posted this information.
Where? Would it hurt to post it again?
I don't recall. I wouldn't hurt, I just didn't take the time to look for it to repost it.

Oh, I thought you'd said that they help Black people with relationship issues, you didn't say specifically they were marriage counselors.

So in other words, my analogy is "irrelevant", simply because it is not going to be entertained.

And this is somehow relevant to the discussion? :confused:
No, the details about my education are irrelevant because it was just an analogy. I have entertained it.

Isn't this a given? Well, perhaps not; I can't seem to tell when you're agreeing with me, and you seem to overstate the obvious when you don't.
It apparantly is not, as you keep saying I am invalidating your views. :laugh: I am considering the source accusing me of overstating anything.

Answering specific questions when asked would help. :fyi:I really can't see how it's that difficult.
I think I've been doing so...

Your response is already over a half-page long. Otherwise, why quote anyone's statments at all? You could do like alot of people here do, and just quote my entire post, and then respond to only to the points that you deem most relevant.
But not 2 pages :) I am trying to respond to the relevant points, but think it's stilly to requote the entire post.

See the statement that immediately proceeded the one you quoted. Once again, you omit the very statements that are crucial to my responses, even as you ask a question in response to it.
Yes, this is going in circles :book:

And now that you do realize this....?
This becomes increasingly futile.

If you can't quantify these experiences in real-time, then what choice does the person that you are sharing these experiences with have, than to not take them seriously?
It seems that is your only option. I think this whole business about "quantifying" experience/knowledge is pointless.

I don't see why this is so difficult; I broke down my perspective of my upbringing, as to not only leave no doubt in your mind about it, but also to paint a larger picture about why I think and perceive relationships and involvements and interactions with Black women the way I do.
And how did that "quantify" anything?

Is it really that much of an inconvenience for you to repeat any of this?
No.

Yes, but that's not precisely what empathy means. To empathize means to identify with the feeling, not the source of the feeling. Have you never been violated in anyway? If you have ever felt any form of violation, powerlessness, helplessness, etc, then you can indeed imagine what it's like to have been raped.
I just don't agree with that. Rape is a very specific experience that is not just about the things you mentioned. I have not experienced loss in any real way, so I cannot understand what it's like to lose a loved one. I've lost very few family members, and not anyone I was really close to.

Didn't you say that alot of your perspectives are based on what others have shared with you?
Yes.

#1) Who said I was doing any such thing? Where did you get that I was doing that in my response to which you quoted?
I did, as you just stated:
But, we are talking about an individual's feelings, and the struggles therewith. I simply think that a better "bed-side manner" is in order here. For example, I recall in another thread adjacent to this one, where you compared my situation to your friend's, in saying that mine is more or less "someone who wants to have sex just because he's in his 30's".

#2) What does that have to do with the question I posed to you?
Nothing, as it was in response to your statement about the other thread. Of course I can see how emotions apply to this topic, but I did not want to state the obvious.

I don't see you interacting with that many people on the boards (not including chat, where I don't go), and certainly not for as long and as often as you do with me.

The length of my posts has nothing to do with how often you respond to them.
Well you don't go in chat and probably aren't tracing my every post. As far as responses, it takes two to tango. You rarely back down from responding to someone. I admit that I am stubborn, which I why I have persisted.

Huh? :confused:

I fail to see how the merging of these 3 statements results in a single point.
The point is, you are asking me the same questions over and over again in the same manner and wondering why you aren't getting the desired response. Is this not the definition of insanity, as you pointed out before? And since it seems you have some privacy issues as well, I am not sure why it is so hard to comprehend someone else's.

Either way, despite my stubborness, at this point I fail to see the value in continuing this exchange and it seems that is something we both agree on.
 

Queenie

going above and beyond
PREMIUM MEMBER
Feb 9, 2001
7,137
2,064
Good grief, can you say B-R-E-A-T-H-E?!? :lol: Uplift, girrrrrlll, I think I already put your name on the list as one of my favorite debaters, but I do believe you have far exceeded my expectations in this thread! :D Whew girl, you can go....can I bring you a glass of water....a sammich....some oxygen...what? I'll even prop you up and let you lean on me for support from time to time...but you'll have to excuse yourself if you need a potty break! :lol:

Ok....please continue.....

Queenie :cook:
 

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